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Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

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Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

Post by Pistol_Pete » Monday, 26 July 2010, 10:03 AM

If I put a second antenna 25' away from my existing antenna what effect will this have on my SWR's? Will thease antenna's work against each other even though I will only use one at a time? I know when you put two antenna's on a semi tractor they say that your signal will be focused to the front and rear of the tractor but that is with the use of a split coax and using both antenna's at the same time. Will it have this effect even though I only have a coax going to one antenna at a time?
Thought that I would ask prior to spending the dollars to install the second antenna that close.
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Re: Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

Post by 420Snowman » Monday, 26 July 2010, 12:06 PM

If you only run one antenna at a time and they are 25 feet apart, I dont see any problem with that at all. Most "big" operators have a vertical and horizontal, and sometimes 3 or 4 antennas on the same mast. You dont have anything to worry about, go for it, have fun, thats what this is all about!! I have a vertical and a horizontal about 10 feet from eachother and my SWR are nearly flat on both.

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Re: Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

Post by Pistol_Pete » Monday, 26 July 2010, 15:01 PM

Thanks Snowman, I appreciate your input and advice. I am running an a Max 2000 for the first antenna so now that I am confortable that I can do this I need to decide what foe an antenna I want for the second one.
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Re: Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

Post by Red Warrior » Monday, 26 July 2010, 15:34 PM

Having two antennas on the same band within one wavelength of each other will cause the radiation pattern to be distorted (just like a beam). Impact on SWR will be minimal.
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Re: Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

Post by Pistol_Pete » Monday, 26 July 2010, 15:40 PM

Hey Red warrior
So long as only one antenna at a time is hot though it will not act as beam, is that correct?
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Re: Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

Post by linx » Monday, 26 July 2010, 16:22 PM

Bleed over is bleed over man. If you run a dirty radio then you will get interference regardless. I have ran tons of antennas in an antenna farm, but mostly on different bands, and if on the same band I use them one at a time.
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Re: Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

Post by Pistol_Pete » Monday, 26 July 2010, 17:00 PM

Thanks linx; I do plan to have only one antenna hot at a time.
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Re: Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

Post by Red Warrior » Monday, 26 July 2010, 18:19 PM

Pistol_Pete wrote:Hey Red warrior
So long as only one antenna at a time is hot though it will not act as beam, is that correct?
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It will have directional characteristics. A beam has a radiator (active) a reflector and numerous directors. Two element dipoles have two elements, one active (radiating) and one passive (not radiating). Any vertical element within 1 wavelength of a vertical dipole will cause a distortion in the pattern the same as a beam (but much less effective).
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Re: Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

Post by 'Doc » Monday, 26 July 2010, 23:21 PM

Got good news and got bad news.
Any two antennas can and will affect each other to some degree, until they get more than several wave lengths apart. The closer they are together the more they can/will affect each other. One wave length isn't a 'magic' number, there's still some affect going on at that distance. Not a huge amount, but some. The closer those two antennas are in frequency, the more they can/will affect each other. That also holds true for any harmonic relationship.
The biggy is if that 'affect' is harmful or not. There are lots of different 'affects' that are not all that bad, if they are noticeable at all. I honestly only know of one sure way of deciding if an 'affect' is good or bad. Right, try it and see. That means there's going to have to be a 'before' and 'after' set of circumstances, and that means more work. Put up one, see what happens. Put up the second one and see what, if any, differences it makes. The only alternative to that is either do a huge amount of information gathering and figuring, or just don't take any chances and don't do it at all.
Why do you want/need a second antenna for? That's an honest question, not meaning you shouldn't have one! I just wonder why.
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Re: Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

Post by Pistol_Pete » Tuesday, 27 July 2010, 5:19 AM

Hey Doc; I would just like to have options up there, being new to base stations and their antenna systems I guess I am curious. I like the set up that I have I just wish it were better. The only thing I know do is start experimenting and I think the antenna is where I will find my best improvements in performance. I should probably raise the existing antenna another 20 feet in the air. But I am curious about other types of antennas as well.
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Re: Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

Post by 420Snowman » Tuesday, 27 July 2010, 6:22 AM

I agree with all the responses on this topic, I am just telling you that I have no problems with mine and if there are any effects of the two being that close, I sure dont see them. Have fun, dont stress about it, just put them up one at a time and see what happens!

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Re: Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

Post by Pistol_Pete » Tuesday, 27 July 2010, 15:56 PM

Thanks Snowman; I certainly do appreciate all the input that I have gotten from all on this subject. I have decided to concentrate on first raising my existing antenna (Max 2000) an additional 14 feet so that I gain enough height to install the ground plan kit that I have for it (that antenna will then be 60 foot high at the top of the antenna). I will then move forward with adding a directional antenna to a second mast 25’ away and will keep the mast about 10’ lower on the second antenna in hopes that it will have little effect on the perpendicular antenna.
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Re: Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

Post by 420Snowman » Wednesday, 18 August 2010, 8:46 AM

I know this is an old post, but I am interested to find out if the 2 antenna's ended up being "happy" up there.....

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Re: Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

Post by Pistol_Pete » Wednesday, 18 August 2010, 10:10 AM

I have not yet finished the antenna project but will update this thread when i do
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Re: Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

Post by 420Snowman » Wednesday, 18 August 2010, 10:21 AM

Sounds like youre as busy as I am!! I havent even picked up the mic in over a week!!! I am having withdrawls...

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Re: Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

Post by Lost Ram » Wednesday, 18 August 2010, 11:23 AM

If you can place them at least 36 feet apart you will see better results. If closer the 36 feet your radiation patter will not be equal. So your signal maybe stronger or weaker in certain directions. It may not be enough to really even notice seeing most homes have fences, utility poles with guy wires, buildings with metal siding ect...
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Re: Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

Post by Red Warrior » Wednesday, 18 August 2010, 17:00 PM

Lost Ram wrote:If you can place them at least 36 feet apart you will see better results. If closer the 36 feet your radiation patter will not be equal. So your signal maybe stronger or weaker in certain directions. It may not be enough to really even notice seeing most homes have fences, utility poles with guy wires, buildings with metal siding ect...


Metal in the near field will impact the magnetic characteristics of the radio signal. In the far field (more than 1/2 wavelength away) most metal is transparent to the RF characteristic unless it is resonant, in which case you set up sympathetic radiation (sometimes called parasitic radiation). That is why we are discussing placing a second 11-meter antenna within the aperture of the primary 11-meter antenna.
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Re: Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

Post by Pistol_Pete » Sunday, 29 August 2010, 14:37 PM

Just wanted to update everybody on the progress here. I know that this thread started with my wanting to add a second antenna 25 ft away from my existing antenna. If you read through the thread you will see that I decided to first raise my existing antenna (Max 2000) an additional 14 feet.
Well today was the day that faze one was completed. My son and I took down the existing antenna and steel mast poll this morning. We then attached the antenna along with a ground plan kit to a fiberglass mast poll that is twice as long (tall) as the steel. The fiberglass mast poll is 28’ tall and tall enough to allow me to use the ground plane kit for the Max 2000. Total height to the top of the antenna is now 52 feet. In addition there are also now 6 guy wires to stabilize the top 14 feet of the mast.
Don’t know if the extra height or the ground plan is responsible but initial contacts are getting very good reports and the receive seems to be much better as well. I am hearing a lot more truck traffic from the interstate now which at its closest point to me is 12 miles away but I am hearing them up and down the interstate for a good distance.
No immediate plan to install the second antenna as I will need at least a month to recover from this job.

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Re: Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

Post by Pistol_Pete » Monday, 30 August 2010, 5:15 AM

This small ammount of additional height and the ground plane kit has made my station come to life!!!! I never knew what I was missing.
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Re: Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

Post by 420Snowman » Monday, 30 August 2010, 6:43 AM

Glad to hear it!!! Height is might my friend!!!

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Re: Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

Post by Lost Ram » Monday, 30 August 2010, 10:47 AM

Thats good to hear!!! Those Imax 2000 are pretty nice antennas!
CB: TRC-450, Imax@50'
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Re: Antenna's 25' apart, does this work?

Post by Nagant » Monday, 30 August 2010, 19:18 PM

Glad to hear raising it helped. Let us know when you get the second one up as I'm curious to see how it works out as well.
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