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Falcon dipole setup

This is the place to post your general tips, or need to have a question on your install here.

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slowpoke1w
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Falcon dipole setup

Post by slowpoke1w » Monday, 11 August 2014, 12:43 PM

Hello everyone, I have a question about a falcon dipole. Which would be the best configuration for me? Info in a rental house and can not mount or install any towers or structures to the house. However I can have a suspended antenna as long as it is temporary ie incase I get evicted it can but removed with very little hassle. I have huge 70-80' pine trees in back yard about 15' from my hobby room. Looking for the best all around performance from this antenna. Anyrecommendations on the setup and coax type and length would like to order coax by the spool of 100' will cut to length if necessary. I will bee using realistic Navajo for base station and maybe a galaxy 33 hml every now and then.


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Re: Falcon dipole setup

Post by MDYoungblood » Tuesday, 12 August 2014, 6:48 AM

It would easy to make one out of wire then to buy that antenna, plenty of posts on dipoles here. All you need is a piece of PVC to make the insulators, 17 ft of wire, and the coax. Any configuration will work, horizontal is best, you still will be able to talk to locals, just your signal strength will be reduced, but you will be able to shoot skip. String it up between the tree and the house, letting the coax drop straight down.

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slowpoke1w
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Re: Falcon dipole setup

Post by slowpoke1w » Tuesday, 12 August 2014, 17:49 PM

Thanks for the reply, I've had the dipole for about a year never put it up. So I'm going to string it up, now the question on coax I dont mind spending a little extra for better coax. ?hat would be the best bang for the buck? I have about $150 left for radio allowance this year. I would like to by a spool of coax but if buying 50' of better coax is the best, I will go that route. I've done loads of mobile installs but this will be my first base. Also I'm scared of hights so I'm only going up on the roof once, and needless to say I'm only going up the tree in tree climber once as well so it has to be good the first time.


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Re: Falcon dipole setup

Post by MDYoungblood » Wednesday, 13 August 2014, 10:31 AM

You can search the internet for good quality coax, Times Microwave, Davis Bury, Andrews, Belden are a few names to look for. How much and what size depends on the length needed, for a base setup I would use the large coax, (RG8/u size), it is roughly a 1/2" in diameter. For a 50ft or less run you can get away with a 95% shield RG8 or RG213, longer runs look for 100% shield like the LMR400.
As for climbing I guess you would have to for the roof but the tree use a weight and fishing line, throw or use a slingshot over the tree and pull a heavier cord back, that way you can lower the dipole to do any adjusting, there are "Youtube's" showing it done.

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Re: Falcon dipole setup

Post by slowpoke1w » Friday, 29 August 2014, 16:13 PM

Thanks for the advice on how to raise the dipole in the tree. I'm gonna use 2 pieces of pvc pipe 20' long 3/4 inside 1" so it wont bend attach the dipole to it, then raise both ends between two trees. I'm gonna use my nephues bow and arrow with a string attached to nylon rope then the rope attached to the ends of the pipe. I cant throw anything as high as the lowest limb on these trees, lowest being about 60' feet or more. estimated length of coax needed 75' so I'm goona use rg8 to start with then up grade to better next year. Also I measured the length of dipole it comes in at about 17'2" is the a 10 meter dipole or is this right for 11 meter?


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Re: Falcon dipole setup

Post by barefoothank » Wednesday, 29 October 2014, 14:17 PM

slowpoke1w wrote:Thanks for the advice on how to raise the dipole in the tree. I'm gonna use 2 pieces of pvc pipe 20' long 3/4 inside 1" so it wont bend attach the dipole to it, then raise both ends between two trees. I'm gonna use my nephues bow and arrow with a string attached to nylon rope then the rope attached to the ends of the pipe. I cant throw anything as high as the lowest limb on these trees, lowest being about 60' feet or more. estimated length of coax needed 75' so I'm goona use rg8 to start with then up grade to better next year. Also I measured the length of dipole it comes in at about 17'2" is the a 10 meter dipole or is this right for 11 meter?
I'm using one of these and I just rolled up the ends and wire tied to set swr.


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Re: Falcon dipole setup

Post by Bluerunner » Wednesday, 29 October 2014, 18:30 PM

Been there done that FAILED, Kinda.

I shot a weighted arrow 60-70 high up in the pine tree with fishing line on it (open face reel). used that to pull up 1/4" rope over a branch with the end of my dipole tied to it. Needed the extra weight on the arrow so it would fall down through the branches.

I set it up as a "sloper" with the lower end attached to my shack at about 15" off the ground, about 60' away from the tree. Used the rope to pull it up 'n down for tuning, then tied it up snug so the wire antenna had not much sag in it. Worked great! at least for a little while. On a breezy day the tree sways enough to pop the #12 solid core copper wire I made the antenna out of. Tried using 16 gauge stainless steel wireline wire instead of the copper wire and it yanked a 3/8" eybolt out that was 3 inches in a 4X4 part of the house framing

Used a bunch of heavy bungee cords to keep the antenna taught but allow to stretch when the tree moved. Unfortunately after about 3 months the bungee cords got bad from the weather & sunlight. Tried a bunch of trampoline springs but never got it just right. Ended up just putting a weight (old brake rotor) on the end of the rope. The rope see saws over the limb in the wind and was wearing on the nylon 1/4" rope. Replaced it with 3/8" Dacron rope which has done well for a few years now and doesn't abrade like the nylon rope. BFW Dacron rope ain't cheap.

Seems like the sloper works good for horizontal & vertical, but probably not optimal for either. At least it is pretty much omnidirectional so I don't have to rotate the house and tree around.

I have a bunch of antennas and that is just one of them. Just thought I'd mention some issues that you might want to keep in mind.

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Re: Falcon dipole setup

Post by drdx » Thursday, 30 October 2014, 8:13 AM

Great advice above, and if you talk locally more, look into making a vertical with a couple of radials out of wire. One vertical wire to the center of the coax connection and 2 or more radials, 2 opposing ones if only 2, and you're good to go. I have personally put those in trees at local parks so I could just pull up, plug into my mobile, and have base station performance while portable.

If you are horizontal in the antenna department and want to talk to locals on vertical antennas, the signal will be down a bit, but as mentioned, on skip it would do well. The horizontal to vertical difference is said to be 20db, or roughly 3+ s-units, a big difference. The bungee approach mentioned above is something I haven't tried, but pines do sway up high a lot. I've dealt with that using dipoles by tieing a pulley to the trees on the ends and using a small bucked with rocks or whatever you have for weight laying around to keep it taut but not too much. You can also get fancy and make pvc weights with sand in them. Drill a hole in the buckets so they don't collect water, get to heavy, and turn into mosquito farms.

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Re: Falcon dipole setup

Post by barefoothank » Thursday, 30 October 2014, 14:52 PM

drdx wrote:Great advice above, and if you talk locally more, look into making a vertical with a couple of radials out of wire. One vertical wire to the center of the coax connection and 2 or more radials, 2 opposing ones if only 2, and you're good to go. I have personally put those in trees at local parks so I could just pull up, plug into my mobile, and have base station performance while portable.

If you are horizontal in the antenna department and want to talk to locals on vertical antennas, the signal will be down a bit, but as mentioned, on skip it would do well. The horizontal to vertical difference is said to be 20db, or roughly 3+ s-units, a big difference. The bungee approach mentioned above is something I haven't tried, but pines do sway up high a lot. I've dealt with that using dipoles by tieing a pulley to the trees on the ends and using a small bucked with rocks or whatever you have for weight laying around to keep it taut but not too much. You can also get fancy and make pvc weights with sand in them. Drill a hole in the buckets so they don't collect water, get to heavy, and turn into mosquito farms.

-drdx
Can the tree cause SWR problems?


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Re: Falcon dipole setup

Post by drdx » Thursday, 30 October 2014, 16:27 PM

Once you get it up you may have to play with the length on the ends but no big deal. I've used pine trees, which don't have overly absorbant leaves as they have needles, and done fine, the same with magnolias as they always have leaves so it is pretty constant. Get it close on swr and roll with it, and if in doubt you can always get a tuner if you're worried about variance or fan the dipole out with more than one length on each side but it shouldn't be necessary as a dipole is wide banded usually.

-drdx


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Re: Falcon dipole setup

Post by 19dt2120 » Wednesday, 19 November 2014, 2:08 AM

To avoid snapping off the wire at tree u can also use a pulley and a counterweight on the wire.
Use enough wire to catch up the swing of the tree!




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